Liberty MavenJoe Wilson vs. Jimmy Carter: Racism and Lies
September 16th, 2009 8:15 am | by Marc Gallagher | Published in Liberty, Maven Commentary, Obama, Politics, Racism | 25 Responses
The morons who are adding the “N word” to the end of “You Lie!” need to simmer down. Yes, that means you Jimmy Carter.
Following Joe Wilson’s outburst during Obama’s address to a joint session of Congress I suggested he was merely representing his constituents. I also suggested that he’s probably a liar too, but not many picked up on that. They were too interested in discussing how disrespectful it was for a man to yell two words at the President during his address, two words that probably should have been three words: “We all lie!”
But what I’m most miffed about is all these charges of racism going around. There’s nothing about what Joe Wilson said that was racist. Those jumping to conclusions about race are instigating racism instead of helping prevent it. Now Jimmy Carter says he believes that Wilson’s comment was “based on racism.” Well I suppose that settles it.
The bottom line is that it is not in any way racist to disagree with the President on health care or any number of issues. Why does having a black President turn so many into race-card-playing Al Sharptons? If this is the way it is 9 months into Obama’s Presidency I’m really starting to worry how this country will be 2-3 years from now.
Here’s a tip. Unless the person disagreeing with Obama is wearing a white hood, is burning a cross, or actually says or writes something that is racist, put your race card back in your pocket where it belongs. If you don’t, you are perpetuating racism by “crying wolf” when there is no “wolf” to be found.
The most recent Rasmussen approval rating for Obama is at 50%. That means that 50% disagree in some way with Obama. Do you seriously believe that in 2009 half of America is racist? I’d suggest seeing a therapist if you do.
Instead of straw-man-jumping directly to racism in your counter-arguments why not argue the actual issue? If you don’t then you are only reinforcing that you have no counter-argument.
Jimmy Carter is setting a very bad example. Do the opposite.
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September 16th, 2009 at 12:24 pm (#)
9/11 puppet
AIPAC puppet
Neocon puppet
Federal Reserve puppet
Uncle Tom or Uncle Sam?
Ventura Sheehan Perot Paul Nader McKinney Kucinich Kaptur Gravel Gonzalez Clemente Choate Carter Baldwin Anderson
September 16th, 2009 at 12:59 pm (#)
They don't seem to realize that they've lost the argument the moment they had to stoop to such low accusations. They've decided to choose racism of reasoning, and they seem to think it's a good idea.
Also, great comparison to the 'crying of wolf' too Marc… couldn't have said it any better myself.
September 16th, 2009 at 1:03 pm (#)
The words don't have to be racist for the comment to be racially motivated.
September 16th, 2009 at 1:07 pm (#)
And yet there's no way to prove that the comment was racially motivated so why even go there? All it does is spawn racism where none likely exists. People disagree with people all the time without it being "racially motivated".
September 16th, 2009 at 1:16 pm (#)
Yes, the words can be racially motivated. On the other hand, they may express only honest disagreement.
The point is that unless one is omniscient and can see into the heart of another person, it's irresponsible (and racist) to ascribe a racial motivation to an expression of disapproval just because those involved are of different races.
September 16th, 2009 at 1:17 pm (#)
it wasn't the comment or disagreement with the president that is viewed as racist. It's the fact that he disrespected the president. He is not new to the House and he knows there is a better venue to voice your feelings and opinions. For him to lack control of himself is not responsible for a person in leadership. Why is everyone making it about the disagreement with the president, it's not about that, it's about the disrespect. If he agreed with everything President Bush said during the joint sessions that's sad and if he didn't, he never spoke out like that. The people that support him should expect him not to agree with the president on things they would want him to disagree on but they should expect him to respect him. What does his behavior say to children that were watching? It's okay to be disrespectful as long as you say I'm sorry when you are under pressure to say you're sorry.
September 16th, 2009 at 1:22 pm (#)
I contend that the comment was not racism, but rather misandrism.
It's as valid a position as Carters, so prove me wrong, or prove him right.
September 16th, 2009 at 1:36 pm (#)
"Do you seriously believe that in 2009 half of America is racist?"
Absolutely. Martin Luther King Jr. was killed 40 yrs ago. And lets not forget that the infamous Jena 6 case was only two years ago. As a black teen myself I can honestly say racism definitely exist. Don't assume that just because you are not being affected by racism yourself that it does not affect other people in America. Stop sugar coating everything and be real about it. Whether or not Wilson's comment was racist or not is debatable but I know for a fact that if it was any other white politician he would have been more respectful. Also to think that the whole of America being such a diverse country is satisfied with the idea of a black president is a naiive thought.
And btw some of my best friends are white.
September 16th, 2009 at 1:40 pm (#)
Why such a rush to push this healthcare reform bill through? The bill is anti-American and Obama (and most politicians) lie all the time to get their agenda through. Joe Wilson drew some attention to this fact. This healthcare reform bill is a big deal. Joe Wilson gambled but he gambled well. Obama was lying and therefore he is a liar. How often have we seen a forum where "real" people can ask direct questions. The same thing happened under Bush with supposed news people with prepared "safe" questions. These people in authority with so much power need to be challenged more. Joe Wilson called Obama out on actual lies so he was actually telling the truth. It was disrespectful but does a liar deserve respect?
September 16th, 2009 at 1:40 pm (#)
Perhaps he won't lie as much! The people behind this healthcare bill are real upset because Joe Wilson has got people talking about the issue rather than buying into the propaganda machine. Saying this is racism is racist and will backfire against them. I think that the reason we got Obama is to divide the nation. The media have been building on this since the election. One example, I saw a news show saying how some white people voted based on race. No mention was ever made that likely 98% of black people voted for Obama. Such complete bias. The media will continue to build on this. Cancel your cable subscription and tell them why you did it!
September 16th, 2009 at 2:45 pm (#)
You say absolutely yet your arguments speak of individuals doing things that are racist. Half of America didn't kill Dr. King. I never said that racism doesn't exist. It most certainly does, but to say that 50% of America is absolutely racist is absurd on its face. If that were true where is the evidence to substantiate it?
How can you know for a fact that if it was any other white politician Wilson would have been more respectful? You can't know that. No one can except for maybe Wilson himself.
Again, I never suggested that the "whole of America" is "satisfied with the idea of a black president". There are certainly people who are not due to their own racism. I'm saying that I don't believe for an instant that 50% of America is that way.
Enjoy, and I appreciate your comment,
Marc
September 16th, 2009 at 3:25 pm (#)
Sure, all of us can, and likely have, retreated to the "all I said was…." defense, appealing to the referential trace of our comment. But it was more than an observation, it was a rude, shouted, interruption. So there's more to it than simply the words uttered. Perhaps Joe Wilson is a member of these neo-Confederate, stars-and-bars-hyping, slavery-defending organizations out of political expediency. We can't "prove" his motivations there, either. It's not racist to rightly call people out for their racism.
September 16th, 2009 at 3:27 pm (#)
Pointing out racism is racist? To quote the great Senator Coburn, you got some splainin to do….
September 16th, 2009 at 3:40 pm (#)
Pointing out racism where none is obviously present is actually quite racist. I don't understand how one can be confused by that. Then again, I'm of the type when I see an apple and someone asks me what it is… I don't say "Yeah, it's an apple but it REALLY REALLY wants to be an orange". I don't say this because there is no evidence of it wanting to be an orange. It's just an apple.
Now if you point out racism where the charge is justified then it is certainly not racist it is merely calling an apple an apple.
Enjoy, and thanks for your comment,
Marc
September 16th, 2009 at 4:16 pm (#)
But I don't want to be absurd on my face!
September 16th, 2009 at 5:28 pm (#)
But Marc, do you think that racism is only contained in overt racist comments? Do you not think that racism is, and racists are, subtler and more complicated than that? Of *course* the defense that it wasn't an overtly racist comment can be used to say it therefore wasn't racist. If the only racism that we can label as such would be overtly hateful and racist speech and actions, then racism will never die, because there are many more covert ways in which it is present in our society.
And Joe Wilson, unlike an apple, is not simply an expression of his genetic code.
Thanks, I appreciate the dialog.
September 16th, 2009 at 7:06 pm (#)
No, racism is not only contained in overt racist comments. But how can anyone else other than the individual really know whether or not he/she is being covertly racist? It shouldn't be an attitude of "hey, let's throw the racist charge against the wall and see if it sticks!"
I would hope that in America we are all innocent until proven guilty. As "Bob" says above no one can really know what is inside another's heart.
The way to minimize racism (I don't know if it will ever die, unfortunately) IS to only accuse those of it who are actually guilty of being overtly racist.
The environment is immediately "racist charged" the minute you mistakenly accuse someone of being racist who was not being racist because you feel you can somehow magically detect racism in his/her heart.
Are we supposed to tip-toe around whenever we disagree with someone and worry that the racism is going to be shoved in our faces every time we vocalize our disagreement using words that are not normally construed as being racist? That only leads to a kind of fear-induced self-imposed censorship, spreads resentment, and potentially causes more racism.
Thanks again.. I appreciate the dialog as well,
Marc
September 16th, 2009 at 10:55 pm (#)
Carter was a hypocrite and know nothing when he was president and it seems nothing has changed. His apinions were not worth two cents when he was in office and they still aren't worth two cents. Wish he could realize that no one is interested in his erroneous slant on things anymore–he is a continuous embarassment to the state of Georgia. Reagan realized Carter was not the brightest crayon in the box when he said, "there you go again" in their debate. If his brain was the size of his misguided ego,then he may could say something worthwhile. Sorry, he just doesn't get it–and he never did. Guess he will spend his remaining days rabble rousing–that seems to be his only talent.
September 16th, 2009 at 7:08 pm (#)
[...] Joe Wilson vs. Jimmy Carter: Racism and Lies :: Liberty MavenThe morons who are adding the “N word” to the end of “You Lie!” need to simmer down. Yes, that means you Jimmy Carter. Followi. [...]
September 17th, 2009 at 12:47 am (#)
A comment was made suggesting more respect would have given if the president speaking was white, well let's assume for a moment that Joe Wilson is black, and the preident is black, is the "you lie" comment overtly or as someone suggested "coverttly" racist? Since President Carter suggested most white americans expressing concern for current administration is racially motivated, I'd like President Carter to let me know who the remaining whites are? I would like him or anyone suggesting Joe Wilson's comment was racist to enlighten me and let me know if I'm part of the most whites category or the minority white category who's just concerned. Sounds racist to me, when I'm left guessing where I fall just because of the color of my skin is white. Put that in your pipe and smoke it PRESIDENT CARTER!!
September 17th, 2009 at 12:49 am (#)
As usual the opponents of any kind of restriction on the illegal immigration, is playing the race card? It's a forgone conclusion that the benefactors of promoting a mass invasion of our shores, such as religious groups, unions, ACLU, radical ethnic caucuses and even our own US Chamber of Commerce, will mouth epithets that doesn't benefit big business, that doesn't advocate a continuous force of illegal cheap labor. Now they are really livid because their objection to E-Verify was thrown out of court. Now all federal contractors and subcontractors must adhere to the law. They have conspired against the American worker and people for too long, and now we are fighting back ourselves against corrupt politicians and other elected officials nationwide,
Rep.Joe Wilson was actually telling the truth at the time, and now Democrats have placed restrictive language in the Health care reform package as a reluctant afterthought by public demand. This was nothing to do about bigotry or racism, but the American workers and family survival. None of the business community who hire them wants their labor, but forces the taxpayer to carry the financial load. The US labor force should not have to be in competition, with people from other countries. Businesses have already offshore American jobs, because it's cheaper? So every illegal foreign national and family member should be exempt from government run health care, jobs and all the billions of taxpayer dollars secretly allocated to pay for their support. Twenty million plus illegal people compromised themselves, when they entered a sovereign nation without permission. Find out the truth at NUMBERSUSA, JUDICIAL WATCH and contact your politician at 202-224-3121 demanding no weakening conditions to E-Verify or any other law authored by Congress.
September 17th, 2009 at 12:35 pm (#)
Why is covertly in quotation marks? Is it not a normal American word?
September 17th, 2009 at 12:38 pm (#)
If workers could organize internationally businesses wouldn't be able to off-load their jobs so easily. Illegal immigration is not simply an issue for conservatives. There are good liberal reasons for wanting to not depress the American economy, which replacing high-wage work with low-wage work obviously does, as anyone who's lost their auto job for a WaMart job knows.
September 17th, 2009 at 3:45 pm (#)
The quotation marks may not have been the right way to get my thought across. Covert can mean secret or insidious. So I guess the use of the quotations was my way of saying I inferred from the use of the word covertly regarding Joe Wilson's "you lie", was that his comment is implied to be insidious. Why? Because he's white and therefore must have been acting stealthy because he is racist and the president is black? I feel words that imply a person's motivation, used over time can become to be thought of as fact instead of opinion. One of the downsides of mass communication. Thanks for letting me explain.
September 19th, 2009 at 1:10 am (#)
[...] Maven’s blogJoe Wilson vs. Jimmy Carter: Racism and Liesasked "Why does having a black president turn so many into race-card-playing Al [...]